Politics And Current Events

Postby **Factorial** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:22 am

Mumia Abu-Jamal apparently in the ICU up in Pottsville. That's too bad.

Going to the bedside vigil?

Postby **shafnutz05** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:25 am

Mumia Abu-Jamal apparently in the ICU up in Pottsville. That's too bad.
Going to the bedside vigil?

Well, I could stop by the Yuengling Brewery

Postby **tifosi77** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:30 am

From the TV thread discussion about 'Going Clear', the HBO documentary about Scientology...

Yeah, i can understand how people got roped in with the self-help stuff. it just goes wacky so quick. Its just painfully obvious that LRH hastily wrote some craphole sci-fi to keep the bs going. LRH walked a fine line between stephen covey and jim jones--but never straying too far to the endgame-type scenarios. When he had the crew and set sail abroad, that could have very well have ended with a murder/suicide situation and it wouldnt have shocked anybody. just frightening to see so many competent people who lost themselves in the process and became prisoners to their own admissions during the auditing process.

People may recoil at how frankly batshit crazy it all appears, but to an atheist it doesn't really look a whole lot different than any other religion. You see David Miscavige on stage at the annual meetings and there are explosions and light shows going on, and it looks terribly theatrical and more show than substance.

Does anyone really believe that if Saint/Pope Peter had access to flashpots and lasers that that's not what Catholic mass would have looked like in 50 AD?

Postby **count2infinity** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:32 am

I'm sorry... coming from my point of view, it's way crazier than many other religions. Far far different from many other religions in my mind.

Postby **Freddy Rumsen** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:36 am

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the ... ax-record/

One of the more outlandish moments of the 2012 campaign came when Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid went to the floor of the world's greatest deliberative body and accused GOP nominee Mitt Romney of not paying any taxes at all for the last 10 years...

And yet, the clip above shows Reid, in an interview with CNN's Dana Bash, not only refusing to apologize for the claim but defending it -- in a very weird way.

"Romney didn't win, did he?" Reid said in response to Bash's question of whether he regretted what he had said about Romney.

Think about that logic for a minute. What Reid is saying is that it's entirely immaterial whether what he said about Romney and his taxes was true. All that mattered was that Romney didn't win.

Postby **malkintent** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:58 am

From the TV thread discussion about 'Going Clear', the HBO documentary about Scientology...

Yeah, i can understand how people got roped in with the self-help stuff. it just goes wacky so quick. Its just painfully obvious that LRH hastily wrote some craphole sci-fi to keep the bs going. LRH walked a fine line between stephen covey and jim jones--but never straying too far to the endgame-type scenarios. When he had the crew and set sail abroad, that could have very well have ended with a murder/suicide situation and it wouldnt have shocked anybody. just frightening to see so many competent people who lost themselves in the process and became prisoners to their own admissions during the auditing process.
People may recoil at how frankly **** crazy it all appears, but to an atheist it doesn't really look a whole lot different than any other religion. You see David Miscavige on stage at the annual meetings and there are explosions and light shows going on, and it looks terribly theatrical and more show than substance.

Does anyone really believe that if Saint/Pope Peter had access to flashpots and lasers that that's not what Catholic mass would have looked like in 50 AD?

i wasnt alive in 50AD so im not going to make such claims about organized religion. this isnt and shouldnt be grouped as such, and im not even religious.

Postby **shmenguin** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:00 am

I'm sorry... coming from my point of view, it's way crazier than many other religions. Far far different from many other religions in my mind.

they all seem crazy to me. this one is on the high end of the spectrum.

Postby **eddy** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:03 am

I'm sorry... coming from my point of view, it's way crazier than many other religions. Far far different from many other religions in my mind.

I agree. It's easy to say there are similarities in other religions, but I can't think of any other religion that forces you to pay $250,000 just to find out what it's about. Can you imagine putting 20 years and endless $ into Catholicism just to get the first book of the Bible? On top of that, there are less than 50,000 members, even Zoroastrianism has over 145,000.

Postby **count2infinity** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:04 am

I'm sorry... coming from my point of view, it's way crazier than many other religions. Far far different from many other religions in my mind.
they all seem crazy to me. this one is on the high end of the spectrum.

I agree, but I think tif was implying that an atheist sees all religions on the same level of crazy, which certainly is not the case for many atheists and agnostics that I know. I agree that to me, there is something a little strange with all deeply religious people. It's certainly a spectrum though... Buddhists aren't on the same level as Scientology just like blue isn't red in the color spectrum.

Postby **shmenguin** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:06 am

while it is crazy, it is what some people believe, right?

i can chime in from the peanut gallery since i think it's all bunk, but if you believe in any of the other religions, seems like you have somewhat of an obligation to respect their...whatever it is.

Postby **PFiDC** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:11 am

while it is crazy, it is what some people believe, right?

i can chime in from the peanut gallery since i think it's all bunk, but if you believe in any of the other religions, seems like you have somewhat of an obligation to respect their...whatever it is.

I could argue that belief or faith in a religion that isn't scientology you pretty much have an obligation NOT to respect their faith. You do, however, have an obligation to respect the members of the religion.

Postby **columbia** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:13 am

So...question here:

If one is "strongly devoted" (whatever that means) to a particular religion, are they more or less likely to respect the faith of others?

Postby **malkintent** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:13 am

while it is crazy, it is what some people believe, right?

i can chime in from the peanut gallery since i think it's all bunk, but if you believe in any of the other religions, seems like you have somewhat of an obligation to respect their...whatever it is.

the disconnect for me is that they dont know what they are buying into until they are already brainwashed. they know nothing of Xenu and that whole spiel until they have already gone through the levels of auditing and clearing.

Postby **shmenguin** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:16 am

i said that wrong...yes, it's not your belief so you don't have to respect it. but if you were to start criticizing specific elements of it, based mainly on their implausibility, then you'd open a door that wouldn't be in your best interests.

Postby **shmenguin** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:18 am

the disconnect for me is that they dont know what they are buying into until they are already brainwashed.

...this is also describing millions of little kids getting dragged to church by their parents

Postby **PFiDC** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:24 am

the disconnect for me is that they dont know what they are buying into until they are already brainwashed.
...this is also describing millions of little kids getting dragged to church by their parents

I'm sure some churches/temples/mosques/etc. force the beliefs. I wouldn't want to attend one that didn't stress seeking on your own and questioning constantly.

Postby **malkintent** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:27 am

the disconnect for me is that they dont know what they are buying into until they are already brainwashed.
...this is also describing millions of little kids getting dragged to church by their parents

i definitely remember those times in church where i had to confess every intricate thought and feeling in my life so it can be documented and used for blackmail at a later date.

Postby **malkintent** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:29 am

As an aside, LRH looks like Leon Rippy.

Postby **shmenguin** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:29 am

forced or otherwise, organized religions continue to perpetuate because of inheritance. there's no need for the church to force anything. your parents force you to go to church, say grace, say your prayers at bed, etc. and from there, you adopt the religion.

i'm aware of your personal history as a latecomer, but you'd agree that you are the exception, right?

Postby **PFiDC** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:11 pm

the disconnect for me is that they dont know what they are buying into until they are already brainwashed.
...this is also describing millions of little kids getting dragged to church by their parents
i definitely remember those times in church where i had to confess every intricate thought and feeling in my life so it can be documented and used for blackmail at a later date.

That's atrocious

Postby **malkintent** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:15 pm

i dont believe that inheritance dictates religious conversion as a whole. People look for things to validate their existence or time on this planet and if they choose to follow a religion, good for them. i hope they find what they are searching for. in every religion (or in some veins of atheism where the eradication of religion is the goal), there are those that pervert the teachings of that particular faith /ideology and thats where it runs afoul. there is no such distinction in this sect of people (scientology), in my opinion. there are no misinterpretations or squabbling over intended meanings. LRH threw people overboard his naval fleet for not succumbing to his whims. He was a man that said the only way to make money was to make a religion. This is cult-like behavior.

Dont take this to think i am in defense of religion, but there are clear distinctions that should be made and actions by an authority need to be taken in terms of the crimes they are perpetrating on their membership. The behaviors and controls that are in place fall into calamity-centric endgames. This is Jonestown in brewing,

Postby **malkintent** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:16 pm

the disconnect for me is that they dont know what they are buying into until they are already brainwashed.
...this is also describing millions of little kids getting dragged to church by their parents
i definitely remember those times in church where i had to confess every intricate thought and feeling in my life so it can be documented and used for blackmail at a later date.
That's atrocious

it was said in jest

Postby **PFiDC** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:19 pm

forced or otherwise, organized religions continue to perpetuate because of inheritance. there's no need for the church to force anything. your parents force you to go to church, say grace, say your prayers at bed, etc. and from there, you adopt the religion.

i'm aware of your personal history as a latecomer, but you'd agree that you are the exception, right?

Exception? Probably not. It's much more common to be raised in the church I guess. I don't know anything on those numbers so I couldn't really say. I do know that more people fall away from the faith (or did they even have it to begin with?) than stick with it...so I guess I'm not the exception. This is strictly speaking for Christianity. I was raised in a Jewish home so, to us, it was "meh...we're good anyway."

We say grace before we eat. We pray a few times a day as a family. We all go to church on Sunday (our son loves to go). We read the Bible together everyday (only 1-2 verses with the boy at this point). Am I forcing my faith on him? I don't think so. I will always teach him to constantly question and seek, to never take what anyone has to say as the hard fact, and to always determine for himself if what he was told or heard or read is true. If there comes a day when he says he doesn't want to come with us on Sundays (or whatever day) and he is old enough to be home alone, he will be welcome to. That may make me an exception as well.

Postby **Freddy Rumsen** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:19 pm

Postby **PFiDC** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:21 pm

the disconnect for me is that they dont know what they are buying into until they are already brainwashed.
...this is also describing millions of little kids getting dragged to church by their parents
i definitely remember those times in church where i had to confess every intricate thought and feeling in my life so it can be documented and used for blackmail at a later date.
That's atrocious
it was said in jest

I think the fact that I couldn't tell and thought it a possibility speaks volumes.