Politics And Current Events

[CBear3]

Judging by the outwardly calm reactions of the other cop, I don't think this was a training issue. And that's why I think Yanez should've been convicted.

So you're saying the other cop thought this was a straight shoot? That Yanez did everything by the book?
If so how can you convict him?
You can sue the pants off the PD for this being acceptable, but Yanez did everything he was told to do.

Just the opposite. Other cop observed his partner unload seven rounds into a parked car with a child in the backseat, and his gun never cleared leather. He knew it was an overreaction from the go.

Gotcha

[shafnutz05]

Oops

http://fox42kptm.com/news/local/nebrask ... g-surfaces

Montag is now looking for a new job. Kleeb let him go after the recording became public.
"I wish he was (expletive) dead," said Montag in the recording.

[tifosi77]

And to that point, the partner cop testified that he did not feel threatened at any point during the stop up to the shooting.

Yanez also testified that he claimed to have seen the gun in the car when he opened fire. It was actually on Castille's person in his pants pocket, and was removed after EMT's arrived and began administering first aid. Yanez's account simply does not have any credibility, and his acquittal (on the least severe homicide charge available in that jurisdiction) is a sad testament to the power of a cop being able to pull the "I felt my life was in jeopardy" defense.

[CBear3]

The other cop was five or ten feet from the girlfriend. I'm not surprised he didn't feel threatened.
I have no doubt Yanez felt he was in jeopardy, regardless of his story on the location of the pistol. Even if he lied, it doesn't change that the primary failure is in not giving clear instructions.

[Shyster]

surprise! The NRA is a racist organization

The NRA's silence is not driven by racism. I will admit, however, that the NRA's silence is absolutely coming from another form of bias. The NRA has long had a very close relationship with both the military and law enforcement, and there are a ton of NRA programs and benefits devoted specifically to cops, including for example college scholarships for the children of LEOs killed in the line of duty, automatic life insurance for LEO members, and the entire NRA Law Enforcement Shooting Competition Program, which includes a bunch of shooting competitions specifically for the police. For example, the NRA has been sponsoring the Pistol Combat Competition (PPC) program since 1960, and while in recent years PPC has been opened to all comers, for decades it was a LEO-only deal.

The tl:dr version is that the NRA is besties with law enforcement and has beaucoup members who are cops, so they don't want to crap where they live and thus stay silent when it comes to cops behaving badly.

[Algernon]

The victim was given no clear instructions.

"dont grab your gun"

okay

He was getting his license.

No where in the video does he say "Stop", "Put your hands on the wheel" or anything reasonable, he reacted like an idiot

This is where the don't-say-gun-to-a-cop thing comes into play. Castille says he has a firearm, and begins reaching for his permit. Cop hears gun, and says "don't reach for it!" The 'it' in that statement meant two different things to Yanez and Castille: To the cop, he was instructing the guy who just told him he was armed to not reach for his gun. To Castille, he was never intending to reach for his gun, and was just trying to accommodate the officer by producing his license/permit.

Don't give the ref a reason to make a bad call.

That literally could have happened to anyone

I could have done the same thing.

[Lemon Berry Lobster]

Isn't there a poster here that has a concealed carry permit and informs the officer if/when he is pulled over? Maybe it's @dodint?

[columbia]

I usually pack heat when posting.
Just so everyone knows.

[tifosi77]

That literally could have happened to anyone

I could have done the same thing.

That was sorta the point of my initial comment. I'm not trying to be blamey, but noting conduct as a sort of 'best practices' thing.

There was absolutely nothing exceptional about the Castille incident up to the moment Yanez lost his composure.

[shmenguin]

I don't think there's any place for the victim blaming with this. If you're the father of a black kid, that's great advice. If you're a 3rd party observer on a hockey board, not only is it in bad taste, but it's simply not worth mentioning - because THAT isn't a problem that needs addressing/solving/casually mentioning.

This is sort of like when someone gets hit with an illegal headshot on the ice and people here are like, "shoulda kept his head up". Well...no. The guy who hit him shouldn't be hitting people in the head. Save the other advice for the coaching staff.

[Algernon]

"Don't reach for it." I believe was the repeated instruction. I'd stop in my tracks whether I was reaching for my registration, a firearm, or a candy bar.
The lack of instructions though is either a PD issue if he wasn't trained to give them or an officer problem if he didn't follow training.
Is it Philando's fault he's dead? No. He could have done more to prevent it, but it falls somewhere in the PD.

Like I said, if he was trained and didn't follow training he should have been convicted. If he wasn't trained, or followed training the death is on the hands of the PD.

That's not a reasonable thing to expect and you can take what you believe you would do and shove it.

No disrespect

[MWB]

Is there some sort of universally accepted practice for how a person carrying a gun should inform an officer?

[CBear3]

"Don't reach for it." I believe was the repeated instruction. I'd stop in my tracks whether I was reaching for my registration, a firearm, or a candy bar.
The lack of instructions though is either a PD issue if he wasn't trained to give them or an officer problem if he didn't follow training.
Is it Philando's fault he's dead? No. He could have done more to prevent it, but it falls somewhere in the PD.

Like I said, if he was trained and didn't follow training he should have been convicted. If he wasn't trained, or followed training the death is on the hands of the PD.

That's not a reasonable thing to expect and you can take what you believe you would do and shove it.

No disrespect

A guy has a gun pointed at me and starts yelling "Don't..." I think it's safe to say I'd stop **** moving. That may be seen as victim blaming, and I'm sorry, but it's also admittedly a lot like what shmenguin said about keeping your head up.

That's just to emphasize the larger point that the officer or his training failed. You brought up Mike Brown and Freddy Gray and everybody keeps pointing to this as a race issue or police brutality or a cop on a power trip. It's none of those things. It's a cop who couldn't handle the pressure of the situation, either because he wasn't trained well or because he failed to execute the training and let a benign situation get out of control.

[shmenguin]

The cop may not be racist, but that doesn't mean this wasn't a race issue. A white guy doesn't evoke the same fear.

[CBear3]

I don't agree, but that's certainly not an argument worth trying to have. Any dude with his woman and baby in the car is pretty low on the threat level until they start reaching for a "gun."

[AuthorTony]

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-m ... story.html

Is it really that hard for police departments to come up with some way of dealing with "aggressive" dogs other than shooting real bullets at them? Regardless of the hundreds of non-violent dogs that are killed every year by trigger happy cops, now we have a dead teenager and a fellow cop who was injured in the reckless shooting. You'd think that a better solution could be found.

[tifosi77]

Is there some sort of universally accepted practice for how a person carrying a gun should inform an officer?

The example I gave of handing over your CCW along with your drivers documents seems to be fairly common. But to my knowledge, there isn't a consensus on what you should do.

However, most outlets where I've seen the topic discussed seem to agree that one thing you don't do is say 'I have a gun' out loud. Those words used together in the context of police contact do no make for a good combination. If you feel compelled to verbalize it, say, 'I have a CCW,' and let the cop ask you if you are armed, to which you can answer 'yes' or 'no' or some other words that do not sound like 'gun'.

[dodint]

Isn't there a poster here that has a concealed carry permit and informs the officer if/when he is pulled over? Maybe it's @dodint?

Yes. Always the first thing I say, with both hands in view.

[MWB]

Is there some sort of universally accepted practice for how a person carrying a gun should inform an officer?

The example I gave of handing over your CCW along with your drivers documents seems to be fairly common. But to my knowledge, there isn't a consensus on what you should do.

However, most outlets where I've seen the topic discussed seem to agree that one thing you don't do is say 'I have a gun' out loud. Those words used together in the context of police contact do no make for a good combination. If you feel compelled to verbalize it, say, 'I have a CCW,' and let the cop ask you if you are armed, to which you can answer 'yes' or 'no' or some other words that do not sound like 'gun'.

I get what you're saying, but based on the audio, it's hard to a) take his tone in any type of threatening way and b) believe that the cop felt threatened based on his verbal response directly after. The officer didn't get ramped up until he reached for something.
In general terms, it would seem bad to use the term "gun." But isn't also say that if a cop just hears "gun" and gets amped up, he's in the wrong profession.

[Freddy Rumsen]

https://twitter.com/CBSEveningNews/stat ... 3318803459

[columbia]

They won't just give them Medicare cards because __________.

[columbia]

White House Warns Reporters Not to Report on Instructions About Not Reporting on Thursday’s Press Conference
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/ ... _dt_fb_bot

[shafnutz05]

Single-payer legislation dead in California...for now

http://www.latimes.com/politics/essenti ... story.html

“SB 562 was sent to the Assembly woefully incomplete,” Rendon said in a statement. “Even senators who voted for SB 562 noted there are potentially fatal flaws in the bill, including the fact it does not address many serious issues, such as financing, delivery of care, cost controls, or the realities of needed action by the Trump Administration and voters to make SB 562 a genuine piece of legislation.”

Rendon took pains to note that his action does not kill the bill entirely — because it is the first year of a two-year session, it could be revived next year.

But the move is nonetheless a major setback for legislation that has electrified the Democratic party’s progressive flank.

Gov. Jerry Brown, who had signaled wariness about the proposal's costs, said in a statement that Rendon "made the case that there’s clearly more work to do before anyone is in a position to vote on revamping California’s healthcare system."

From another article, that pointed out the bill would save the state approximately $37 billion annually;

The committee’s analysis projected that the statewide plan would cost $400 billion annually, half of which would likely need to come from workers and businesses through a 15 percent payroll tax.

15%....damn.

[columbia]

As someone who has a lot of dead relatives in the state, this is about as SC as you can get:
http://thetandd.com/news/local/business ... 7c840.html

@digitalgypsy66

[Freddy Rumsen]

https://twitter.com/yashar/status/878437465282953216